A vicar as celebrant for the Lord's Supper
An open question: if a vicar is the only man serving at a congregation (the supervising pastor is at a nearby parish) and an ordained pastor cannot be present during the Divine Service as celebrant, which of the two seems preferable (or least problematic):
1. Have a pastor come up before the service (e.g., Saturday night) and "pre-consecrate" the elements
2. The vicar should eat his concerns over violating the office and be the celebrant, since he is "licensed" to do so by the district (no, the vicar did not ask for this)
Please note that there is no option 3 (the vicar should not have been put in this situation in the first place). Your thoughts would be apprciated, assuming that they are coherent--
1. Have a pastor come up before the service (e.g., Saturday night) and "pre-consecrate" the elements
2. The vicar should eat his concerns over violating the office and be the celebrant, since he is "licensed" to do so by the district (no, the vicar did not ask for this)
Please note that there is no option 3 (the vicar should not have been put in this situation in the first place). Your thoughts would be apprciated, assuming that they are coherent--
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Replies to This Discussion
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Permalink Reply by Didymus20X6 on -
Yet one more reason why we need to clearly define the Office of Holy Ministry in terms of our Confessions, rather than adopting practices that only seem right.
There is an option 3, though: the supervising pastor and vicar can trade off. The supervising pastor can administer the Sacrament to the other congregation on an occasional basis, while the vicar guest-preaches at the other congregation. Sure, it might mean that the vicar's congregation would only be able to partake irregularly, but at least it would allow the two congregations to remain faithful to the Confessions.
I myself have concluded that vicarage is an outdated practice; it has outlived its usefulness. With more and more second-career students and first-career family men, it makes much more sense for them to simply complete their education at the Seminary in 3 years, and be called and ordained into a congregation after graduation. Functionally, it would work like a convertible vicarage. This would save an awful lot of hassles with moving (difficult for families, not exactly fun for single guys), class scheduling, and, most importantly, clearly defining the Office.
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Permalink Reply by Ken Humphrey on -
Your idea of trading pulpits is a good one, and has been suggested. What would you suggest if this option were not available to the vicar?
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Permalink Reply by Dennis Peskey on -
Number one is unacceptable. The congregation of saints is not present for the consecration of the elements, hence no "communion". This borders on the beginnings of the private mass and all the baggage associated therein.
Number two is unacceptable. The vicar is neither ordained nor properly called to the congregation; ergo, he should at no time assume the position of celebrant regardless of what other "men" say. We do not "license" people to the position of Christ; if the District President does not appreciate nor comprehend Christ's true body and blood are the issue, let him be anathema.
Number three (unstated, but real). The vicar would be forced to reject both options as violations of our confessions and the Word of God. I believe it was once said, "Here I stand, I can do no other. God help me!"
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Permalink Reply by Didymus20X6 on
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"Preconsecration" in my thinking separates the Sacrament from the direct application of the Word. We're not Romanists.
At the same time, I do not think the vicar should simply acquiesce. The only possible exception to this would be if he's a "convertible". But still, a vicar under ordinary conditions is not a called and ordained servant, and should uphold the confession teachings of our church.
I do not see either option as really an option at all.
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Permalink Reply by TSchneider on -
I agree with all that everyone has already said. As a seminary student to enter his first year of study in Canada this sounds a situation that I would not like to be in, and a position that no vicar should be in. However, I believe that there is always an option 3. The vicar can, and should, say, "No. This is not right and I will not do this."
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Permalink Reply by Pastor Everette E. Greene (Trail Guide - OH) on -
It is really a shame that supervisors would put a vicar in this situation in the first place. That's why supervisors should be thoroughly screened by the seminaries before they are given vicars!
The trading pulpits is the only viable solution. It has been done.
I remember one professor at the seminary urging us to refuse to consecrate the elements as a vicar. He likened it to pre-marital sex (doing something before you are allowed to). He also stressed the fact that if you do it before ordination, you have nothing to step into when you are ordained. As we step into the office of the holy ministry we get to celebrate the Lord's Supper. If we are the celebrant before we are ordained, then we have nothing to step into when we are truly in the office. (I said that kind of clumbsily but you see what I mean.)
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Permalink Reply by Rev Joseph Weatherell on -
I have an acquaintance who just started his vicarage. he was put in a position where was expected to preside over the service of the sacrament and consecrate the elements on his own. When I asked if he had brought his concern up to the DP or the sem, he told me that both the DP and the seminary approved this. He is a student at Fort Wayne.
I was quite dismayed at this.
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Permalink Reply by Marin Swofford on -
A classmate (CTS) of my husband was also expected to do this on his vicarage. (With seminary's and DP's approval)
It was expected of him. No questionscouldshould be asked.
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Permalink Reply by Mark on -
You beat me too it, option 3 is correct. Not only does it solve the problem, but it gives the Vicar a broader experience.
If not vicarage, then ordain with a mandatory, assigned mentor through Circuit or District. I have seen too many recently ordained clergy get in binds due to lack of experience.
Mark
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Permalink Reply by Rev. Matthew Gunia on -
I had a similar situation where my supervising pastor was called away (out of town) to attend to a family emergency and I was at my vicarage congregatin alone--on the Sunday a baptism was to be conducted. I told the head elder and chairman of the congregation that the Seminary had me take an oath during orientation and I swore that I would not baptize or preside over the Lord's Supper until ordanation. I was able to secure a local associate pastor to baptize the infant at the service and preside over the Lord's Supper and thus kept true to my vow.
I figured that if if I was in that position again, I would have the entire congregation speak the Words of Institution along with me...that way (I reasoned) we were all concecrating the elements and I wasn't really presiding over Communion.
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Permalink Reply by Pr. David Gallas on -
These truly are terrible situations!
My heart goes out to vicars placed in those congregations. It's not fair to them.
I don't believe the first two options are possible at all which leaves the unwritten option 3.
If the practice is in violation of Scripture and our Lutheran Confessions, then there is no counsel to give but for him to refuse to celebrate the Sacrament. If the vicar participates his conscience will suffer. God must be obeyed and not men. Obviously this counsel is easier said than done. There may be a huge cross to suffer. His vicarage may be in jeopardy. Yet, he and all of us must be faithful when facing any difficult situation. There we commend all into the Lord's hands, trusting that He brings good out of suffering.
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Permalink Reply by Pastor Everette E. Greene (Trail Guide - OH) on
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I too don't like the idea of "pre-consecration". But the other option of switching pulpits can work. I know of a vicar who was a classmate of mine who was at a congregation without a pastor. His supervisor was across town and on communion Sundays they would switch pulpits.
Now this wouldn't work with my congregation as we celebrate the Lord's Supper every Sunday. But even in our case, they would just have to go to every other Sunday until they get a new pastor.
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